TTMWL: Episode 3 — “What’s the Difference Between a Learning Culture, Training Culture, and Training System?” with LDRM’s Doris Tempelmeyer

Training the Modern Workforce Live is a weekly show discussing training and talent development solutions and best practices. Hosted by Allogy CEO Colin Forward, each episode features an informative conversation with a prominent guest in the training world.

Watch the full video interview above, listen on any of the platforms below, or continue reading to see the full transcript (edited for clarity).

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About Doris Tempelmeyer, Training Manager at LDRM

With a background in teaching and as a business owner, Doris Tempelmeyer utilizes both sides of her resume as a corporate training manager. Now in her fourth year at LDRM, she has completely redesigned their training program and is in the process of expanding to other locations nationally. Her high-impact, on-demand performance solutions certification is proving highly useful in the company’s overnight shift from in-person classroom to online instruction earlier this year. She operates with a never-give-up attitude and believes everyone has the ability to accomplish great things if given the right path.

Episode Transcript

Adam Wagner:
Hello, everyone, and welcome back to Allogy’s podcast, Training the Modern Workforce Live, the bi-weekly show discussing training and talent development solutions and best practices. Each episode, we’ll talk about a different training topic, and make sure to keep an eye out for special guests and interviews from top training professionals.

With me, as always, I have Colin Forward, CEO of Allogy. For the last decade, Colin has provided major U.S. hospitals and federal agencies with distance learning solutions. He’s an alumnus of UCF’s Institute of Simulation and Training, where he studied mobile technology under Dr. David Metcalf while earning a degree in computer science and his MBA.

Joining Colin this week is LDRM’s training manager, Doris Tempelmeyer. With a background in teaching and as a business owner, Doris utilizes both sides of her resume as a corporate training manager. Now in her fourth year at LDRM, she has complete— completely redesigned their training program and is in the process of expanding to other locations nationally. Her high-impact, on-demand performance solutions certification is proving highly useful in the company’s overnight shift from in-person classroom to online instruction earlier this year. She operates with a never-give-up attitude and believes everyone has the ability to accomplish great things if given the right path.

This week, we’re going to be talking about training as an investment. All organizations provide some sort of training, but it’s important to create a system that leads learners to not only be engaged but successful as well.

We’ve got some great questions on deck already, but feel free to ask any questions that may come up in the chat, and we’ll get to as many as we can. Alright, Colin, over to you.

Colin Forward: Great. Thanks, Adam. And thanks, Doris, for joining us today— really appreciate your time, and I’m excited for this conversation.

We’re going to dig into some of the different intended outcomes of investments that people make in training. But to set us up, why don’t you talk a little bit about some of the work that you’ve been doing recently because I think a lot of learning professionals would probably relate.

Doris Tempelmeyer: During the first of the year when COVID hit, prior to that, we were focused on just in-classroom training. And yes, we do have some activities, some materials already that are interactive, but the challenge that came earlier this year, we turned around all those hard papers, hard copies into an interactive approach.

Some trainers’ comfort zone is just what they are used to being, and they don’t know the usage of this technology—PowerPoint, Adobe DC—how to create those interactive or simulations. So, it was quite a challenge, but we did it.

Colin Forward: Yeah, so obviously, learning professionals all over the place right now are facing a lot of these same challenges. Do you feel like that’s a matter of a skills gap or a system gap or just a culture gap? Like, what are the specific improvements that you’re looking to make within this team of instructional designers you’re working with?

What Training Improvements Are You Making Due to COVID-19 Restrictions?

Doris Tempelmeyer:
Well, first and foremost, you have to have a system in place, technology-wise. Right? If you don’t have the right technology, then you can’t have the right materials for your delivery because that’s one key also for the delivery. But we do have, say for someone, Microsoft Word or any systems that are built-in already—you can utilize those. PowerPoint, for example, there’s a lot of things you can do with PowerPoint, but some trainers don’t know that it exists.

Most of the systems, I would say 10 percent of that is what is utilized. Ninety percent, they don’t know about it. So, as for me, I learned this not through school—save for some of the PowerPoint. I don’t go to school where I can just study about all PowerPoint, but just go seek and find, and it’s kind of part of the generative learning approach, I would say.

Colin Forward: Yeah, so it’d have to be pretty self-directed, I guess. So it’s mostly in that case where you’re talking about getting the most out of the tools that you have. This is kind of a train the trainer effort. Is that something that you took on in a formal capacity, or is it something that you’re just doing informally in the course of your work managing the scene?

Is Your Train the Trainer Curriculum Formal or Informal?

Doris Tempelmeyer:
Well, again, coming from a teaching background and a business background where I’m the one who developed, along with my husband—we developed our own website. So, you have to speak the language of the audience. I would say, if you are going to develop something that your customers, your clients don’t need it—what’s the use? It’s moot. You’re just spending a lot of dollars for it. So you have to get the most out of it in order for the results that you would like to meet that goal, to meet for your audience.

Colin Forward: So how do you set those expectations for the folks that you’re working with for the trainers and those teams?

Doris Tempelmeyer: So similar to the training, you have to teach them; you have to train them with the process. So the train the trainers, before we even teach the trainees who will be going through enrolled in the program, the train the trainers, I have to start with them. So with that, it’s not just the mechanical process. I start to develop their critical thinking.

That’s the most important skill set that they have to have. Without that, how can they apply? How can they think outside the box when they are out in the field? So that’s one thing that I have provided to the trainer. So, it may be understanding the concept of the lesson plan because most of the trainers, most of my trainers, don’t go to education school.

So they don’t know what a lesson plan is. So, you know, before they can build it, they have to understand it. The same thing as how you use the syllabus, how you develop training materials. So there is a lot of models for that one. You can’t just go ahead and create something. You have to follow the principles of that.

Colin Forward: And so do you have a specific model, or:

Does Your Organization Have a Specific Model for Tracking the Competency of This Training and These Instructional Designers?

Doris Tempelmeyer:
 Yes, I do. So, as far as for the learning for the trainers, if you’re familiar with Bloom’s Taxonomy, I start with that one. So in creating our lesson plan, our syllabus, even a rubric, I look at the Bloom’s Taxonomy because that’s more on the individual level. And then, from that, the overall training program, I have utilized ADDIE.

Again, training is not a straight line; it’s a cycle. You start from training-needs assessment, going to the business units to understand what the problem is. Similar to if you’re going to the doctor, the doctor will have to know what the problem is—they can’t just give you a prescription. So they have to go and x-ray and whatever it is that they have to do in order for them to provide you the correct prescription.

So it’s similar to that training. So I have to conduct a training-needs assessment whether training is the answer or not because, again, most of the organizations, “Oh yes, this person needs training.” Because again, you have to look at the holistic view of it. Is it the organizational level, the systems level group, or individual level? So that is the reason why I have to do the training-needs assessment.

Colin Forward: Yeah, that makes sense. I mean, we’re talking about making these investments in training, and anytime you make a significant investment, you’re going to want to measure the return. So, based on what you’re saying, it sounds like you’re probably going to be tying that investment back to a few different outcomes. I heard you mention Bloom’s Taxonomy and ADDIE and then some of the business needs that come up from the groups that you’re supporting with training. So what are you tying those investments back to? What are your measures of success in the system?

To Which Measures of Success Are You Tying Your Training Investments?

Doris Tempelmeyer:
I like cooking. In cooking, there’s a recipe that you have to follow, but I’m the kind of person that I’m not good at following the recipe. I have to test here and there—a little bit of that, a dash of pepper, or whatever it is.

Colin Forward: I’m the same way.

Doris Tempelmeyer: So with that, I do have the three main recipes that I put in order for that effective training. One is the training system to be in place. The training system is the structure. It’s the foundation that entails your training plan, your syllabus, and the training materials. It’s the formal blueprint of your training program.

And then, the second recipe is the training culture. It is an environment where the organization sees value in training. Business units openly request training programs and services. So, training culture is also driven by the management and supervisors who seek to improve operational performance.

So in order for them to have the buy-in, you have to deliver those needs for the business unit. Once you deliver those needs at the end of the training that they get their business results, they get their ROI—the result of that is they would like to ask more from the training department. That’s the value in it. That’s the culture. So it’s not just the training department. You partner with the business units, you partner with the trainers, you partner with the senior management team, even. So, it’s not a solo project; it’s a collaborative effort.

Colin Forward: Yeah, for sure. I mean, we’ve talked a lot about getting that kind of buy-in even on our last episode where we’re talking about change management. So to that end, I’m wondering:

Is There a Distinction that You Would Draw Between a Learning Culture and a Training Culture?

Doris Tempelmeyer:
Yes. So training culture, it is instructor-driven—the training. Learning culture is the learners—learner-driven or, I would say, individual-driven. The learning culture is a desire to increase knowledge on the individual level, rather.

So, I would like to tie this in with that buy-in. Your training won’t be effective if you don’t have buy-in from the individuals themselves. So, what that means is if you are just forcing the individual to go into the training program, “Oh, by the way, you’re going to be trained on this course or whatnot.”

If that individual doesn’t have buy-in, your training is not effective, the knowledge transfer isn’t there. So one, you waste your time for your trainers. You wasted their time, their productivity time, and overall, the ROI isn’t there. So it is important to have all those buy-ins but from the management level down to the individual who’s going to participate in the course.

Colin Forward: Yeah, so that rings true to me. If we step back for a second and we look at this idea of a learner culture—kind of a two-part question here:

How Do You Measure Your Baseline and Go About Investing in a Learning Culture?

Doris Tempelmeyer:
I would say, again, I would like to use all three. Okay, all three. With that, all three, I would like to have the training system as our foundation. It’s at the bottom. Without that structure, anything more will collapse. And then, the next layer is the training culture. It offers value to the business unit.

And then, the top layer is the learning culture. Without management, the support beneath it, individual support will not stand up.

Colin Forward: Okay. I think there are probably a lot of organizations where they feel like they have a system or they know how they want to deliver training. They have buy-in from the training team, but they’re not quite sure if the learners are going to be engaged, if the learners are eager for training, or if they’ve embraced that culture. So do you have a way to measure that? Do you have a way to, sort of, say whether it’s qualitative or quantitative? Is there a way to say, “Hey, I think our team is ready and receptive, or maybe we need to set some expectations so that people are more engaged in training?”

Doris Tempelmeyer: I do measure the individuals who were in the training. And not only the individuals, I also grade the trainers because, perhaps, it’s the trainers also that needs more training, needs more professional development. So for the individual level, for the participants, the trainees, I do the knowledge and their skills. I have the benchmark when they were at the business unit. Say, for example, they’re just going to be retrained. So I do have their benchmarks already from the unit.

And then, when they are in training, while they’re doing the hands-on training, then we have the results for that one to compare from their benchmark. And then, we do also conduct 30-, 60-, 90-day post-training. That’s when you can really assess their expertise once they get out from the training.

Did they apply the knowledge that they have learned during the training period, or have they developed their expertise? So, again, that 30-, 60-, 90-day, that’s the most important aspect of the assessment—whether the training program is successful or not. Then, that’s the time that you can, “Okay, you know what? We have to make some adjustments because we haven’t met the goal.” Then, you can adjust your program. It’s part of continuous improvement.

Colin Forward: Sure, that cycle you were mentioning.

Adam Wagner: All right, guys. I think that’s a pretty good start here. We actually covered the first question from Laura A. So I’m going to jump into Pritpaul B’s question. He asks:

Our Organization Has a Few Instructional Videos But Not Much Else. Would You Consider that a Learning Culture, Training Culture, or Training System, and Which Would You Recommend?

Doris Tempelmeyer:
 Why not all three?

Colin Forward: Ideally, right?

Doris Tempelmeyer: Yeah. So, these are not necessarily mutually exclusive. Instead, they are built upon each other, like a three-layer cake similar to what I have discussed earlier.

Colin Forward: So, I guess we’ve been talking about how a lot of these folks are having to go from maybe just doing all classroom sessions, doing all face-to-face, and going remote. You know, and maybe in that environment, they would feel confident saying, “Yes, we have a system, we have a training culture, we have engaged learners.”

But if I understand what the question is getting at, it seems like there are a lot of people out there that are under these new expectations, having to take their PowerPoints or some existing piece of content and repurpose it, which it sounds like you’ve been doing a lot with your Adobe and PowerPoint and that kind of thing. So where does someone in that position start? When you go from having an in-service, classroom-based training system that seems to be working, and now you have to do something new, what are the first steps that you start to take?

Doris Tempelmeyer: Start with a plan. Planning is the key. After you have that plan, then organize it.

Before you can develop something, in order for you not to waste your time and do your content right away, everything starts in the planning. You have to have that script. You have to have that storyboard. So from that storyboard, once you have all those scripts, all those content, then that’s the time to go ahead and see if you have all of those.

Create a checklist. Do I have everything in here? Am I missing something? And also, sometimes we have to ask a fresh set of whys, right? That comes in the quality checklist. It may not be you—a colleague, maybe. Stakeholders have to be a part of it. So the stakeholders might be the SME, might be the training manager, might be one of the supervisors from the business unit. So, again, tying that in the business unit is part of that process.

Colin Forward: Sure. Yeah, I mean, one thing we’ve seen crop up a little bit with people that are having to develop these new systems is collaborative learning, bringing in someone from the business unit to help with instructional design. Is that something that you’ve been doing much, or is the instructional design kind of happening in silos?

Doris Tempelmeyer: Before, it was in silos. And, again, as a training manager, it has to go to an approval process. So I have to approve it. But looking at this, and again, coming from a teaching background and knowing the principles—especially for eLearning principals—I said, “You know what, we’re missing this.” So you’re not only critiquing that person, but you’re also coaching that person in order for that person to adjust their course and perfect it and then deliver in a most-effective way.

Colin Forward: Yeah. So, do you think that for most organizations that are going through these changes that bringing in those SMEs from the business unit should be standard practice, or do you think it’s just case by case?

Doris Tempelmeyer: I would say, again, because it’s a collaborative effort, you have to have an SME. You have to have the instructor because the instructor already knows the principal. The SMEs might not know the principles of teaching, the principles of eLearning. The SME knows the process. So you have to have all those parties involved with it. So not just the SME, the instructor is involved there. And even that we also have a processor involved in that process. The CSA is involved in that process, right?

Colin Forward: Can you break that— a CSA?

Doris Tempelmeyer: CSA: customer service analyst. So that CSA, they perform some processes. So it’s important for them because, again, we are trying to speak their language. They are our customers, not us. We are trying to deliver the product, not us. So again, that’s part of the needs assessment. That happens from the get-go before we develop and design the training materials.

Colin Forward: Okay. Yeah, I think that’s what I’m looking for is how are those SMEs coming in and contributing? And it sounds like you’re saying that is really important for making sure that you’re speaking a language, you’re not developing something in isolation, and it’s going to be relevant to your learners.

Doris Tempelmeyer: Right.

Colin Forward: So we’ve kind of stepped through the process of you’ve got this new challenge, you create a plan, and you organize with different people that are going to be participating. You bring in the subject matter experts, and then you try and hold people accountable to that plan. And then you start delivering training, right?

Doris Tempelmeyer: Correct.

Colin Forward: So then, what does that look like? You know, again, setting this baseline for a new system, how do you evaluate from day one how this new approach is working and if learners are engaged?

How Do You Measure Success and Engagement in a New Training System?

Doris Tempelmeyer: Looking at their metrics. So, we do have their scorecard. Each person who’s going to the course has a report card. And daily, I look at their report cards. Are they improving? Are they not? But that report card won’t be implemented during their hands-on training. During the first week, it’s not statistically significant yet because they don’t have that many processes that they have performed.

But the second week is where you can really see their numbers. Okay, so are they progressing? The first week of their hands-on training, if they are under 30 percent, we’re on the right track. And then, the second week, that’s the 70 percent. Yay, we’re on the right track. Okay. And then by the end of the training period, the hands-on training period—that’s the third week—your expectation is everybody should be in that 80 percent to 100 percent.

If you can see the second week, you will see this person was going downwards. That’s when you have to diagnose. I have to ask, “What happened in here?” I’m not the only one who’s diagnosing this one. We trained the trainers on how to diagnose that problem because, again, I want them to be accountable to understand the metrics not just delivering the training. They have to understand the performance analysis of each individual.

So when you have that assessment, then you have to go deeper. Again, Simon Sinek, start with why. Why this person? And then why is it going this one? Why is this person going sideways? So everything there, go deep down, do a root-cause analysis for that one. And then, “Oh, by the way, this person is struggling with this metric.” Then, focus on that one.

Colin Forward: Yeah, so when you’re saying 30 to 80 percent, what metric is that? Is that just comprehension or what are we measuring there?

Doris Tempelmeyer: Skills. It’s the skills.

Colin Forward: Okay, so competency.

Doris Tempelmeyer: Yes.

Colin Forward: Okay. And do you have a standard way for setting that scale for each skill?

Doris Tempelmeyer: Yes, I do. So, again, having those benchmarks, and then comparing it from the previous class from the same course, and then match it with that current class you have, and then following that trend, that’s how you really dig into that assessment process for that individual.

Adam Wagner: Alright, I’m going to jump in here real quick actually. Danielle P. had asked how you build a successful training structure, but I feel like we kind of got to that point there. So, at this point, we’ve kind of discussed creating the training system, creating the training culture, and getting things set up. And we know learning culture is where the learners are engaged.

So Joe B. asked:

The $100 Million Question Is How Do You Engage Individuals So that They Want to Learn?

Colin Forward:
Especially over this example you just gave where it’s a three-week process.

Doris Tempelmeyer: If I get this right, I’ll retire well off. But it certainly sounds easy, much like putting a bell around the cat’s neck. Implementing the plan takes a bit more work. So I will offer a few avenues of approach here.

One, speak in terms of what is important to them. Okay. It’s like a car salesman speaking safety to me, better fuel efficiency to my husband, and red convertible to our daughter. Okay?

Two, play on their home field. Demographics play a huge role. For example, last week, my daughter called me and said, “Mom, I have a chemistry project. And my professor assigned this project and just let me know that I can choose whatever delivery method that I have to do. What channel that I would like to choose. Is it okay to deliver it through TikTok?” She’s 20 years old, and you know TikTok right now.

I said, “That’s a great idea.” Said, “Why wouldn’t you use that one?” So, she spent hours and hours and hours in TikTok, redoing it, you know, until she perfects it. And then, she came to me and said, “Can you please go ahead and critique and edit or whatever I need to reduce it?” That’s perfect.

So because of that, her engagement was off the chart. So it’s not only that engagement, that knowledge retention is there. Right? So as we know in training, better engagement leads to better knowledge transfer and retention.

Colin Forward: So I don’t imagine that you’re using a whole lot of TikToK at LDRM.

Doris Tempelmeyer: Unfortunately, we can’t.

Colin Forward: Yeah, no. There’s something to that, though. I mean, you really want to make sure that you are hitting your audience where they’re going to be receptive. Right? So, you had one more point. You said there were three things, right? What’s your third point first before I dig into that?

What Are High-Impact, On-Demand Performance Training Solutions?

Doris Tempelmeyer: So the last one is engagement and can be a real challenge when you’re no longer face to face. That human interface is not there. Right? You don’t know. Are they leaning forward, or are they leaning backward? Did they just nod their head?

But sometimes, even in the classroom, when you look at them, if you see that blank face, you can tell right away that this person is not getting it. Right? You don’t have that online. So that’s where you use the high-impact, on-demand performance training solutions. The high impact is the one that drives business results.

You are trying to convert the state of this learner from not being able to accomplish this task to being able to accomplish that task to drive business results. That’s the high impact. Everybody’s happy. It’s a win-win. Right? The on-demand part, that’s the small nuggets of learning: what they need, where they need it, when they need it.

It’s not the whole; I just need this part. Can I just focus on this part? That’s the on-demand part. Might be online, it might be asynchronous, might be synchronous, it might be blended—whatever delivery method you would like to have.

Colin Forward: Yeah, so given Allogy’s mobile focus, the whole on-demand use case is something that we’re very tuned into. So I’m curious to know what you find works best for these just-in-time learning resources.

What Works Best for Just-In-Time Learning Resources?

Doris Tempelmeyer:
For me, as long as I have the four assets. The four assets of the high-impact, on-demand—which audio, the visual, the conversation, the simulations—all those four assets should be present. That’s where you get your ROI. That’s how you will be able to have that engagement in lieu of that face to face. You should have all those four because, again, what drives us?

If I am training myself, I would like to have that feedback right away—not the next day, not the second day. But I would like to have the interactive simulations where when they answer, this is the answer, and it gives them feedback right away. They don’t have to wait for the trainers to tell them what to do. It’s right there at the tip of their finger, right?

Colin Forward: Yeah, responsive.

Doris Tempelmeyer: Yeah.

Colin Forward: So, I’ve seen groups that try and do all of that with one tool, and I’ve seen groups that use a different tool or multiple tools for each of those four points that you mentioned. What do you find is the best approach to that? Does it all have to be integrated, or are there ways to do those things on different platforms? What works best?

Do Your Training Tools Need to Be Integrated?

Doris Tempelmeyer:
One of my favorite tools—again, because it comes in with Microsoft—is Sway. So Sway, in a way that you can plug in whatever platform you may utilize for your visual, whatever platform you may utilize for your audio. And then, incorporate all those into one program. Again, as long as I, as a learner, can pull that subject that I just want to learn. I mean, it doesn’t matter what method, what platform you’re using, as long as it’s there any time when I need it.

Colin Forward: So, fragmentation isn’t a big concern for you? You don’t worry too much about having too many different touch-points?

Doris Tempelmeyer: Well, the touch-points, again, what I always tell my teams is that I don’t care how you get there, as long as you’re meeting the objective. Okay, if the objective is I would like to have this training delivered as effective as can be, either whatever tool you have, use it.

Colin Forward: Yeah, and is that something that you end up kind of deciding dynamically, like seeing what works or—

Doris Tempelmeyer: What works and not works. That’s part of the generative process. Trial and error.

Colin Forward: Are you getting that feedback from learners mostly or from the trainers, or how are you measuring that?

Doris Tempelmeyer: All of them. All of the above. So we look at the perception results. Again, after training-needs assessment, we do conduct the results assessment. So one of the domains is the perception results.

It may come from the stakeholders and also the individuals. So we look at those perception results, and then we adjust our training material from there.

Colin Forward: Okay, and then, just real quick: are most of your perception assessments and the ways that you’re collecting that data, are those integrated to the training tools themselves, or are you doing that separately?

Doris Tempelmeyer: I’m doing it separately. I wish I had a system that everything is in one place. That’s my life just easy and then just focus on the things that I do. Right?

Colin Forward: Right, right. So, I mean—not necessarily for you personally but for your entire training operation—what percent of your time and resources goes into collecting and analyzing that data?

Doris Tempelmeyer: 60 percent.

Colin Forward: 60?

Doris Tempelmeyer: Yeah, 60 percent. Well, there’s a day that I will just shut my door and just do the analysis. Because, again, it’s not just their knowledge just during this period, I have to do some comparison from the previous class and then the comparison after 30, 60, 90 days. It takes a lot of time.

And now, granted, you have a lot of other responsibilities also, but that analysis is the key for you to offer a prescriptive solution to the business unit because the business units are your internal customer, and you would like to have that customer come back to you, “Hey, we would like to have more training.”

Colin Forward: Right, establishing that learning culture.

Doris Tempelmeyer: Yeah, and I make sure also that I will connect with them just to make sure that I still have my job the next day.

Colin Forward: Yeah, well, we’re all working for that. I mean, 60 percent is huge. I mean, I think that really puts a point on how important it is to have that kind of thing in a training plan from the get-go, right?

Doris Tempelmeyer: Yes. I mean, it would be nice if we had a system that’s a one-stop shop.

Adam Wagner: Alright, so we have one more question. I saved this one for the end because I feel like it’s a good wrap: “Could you break down three major takeaways about this topic?” That was from Bianca D.

Doris Tempelmeyer: First, build the cake from the bottom up. It’s easier that way. Connect with business units and trainees on their level. Offer what’s of value to them. Last, do not lecture, engage them.

Colin Forward: That last one, that seems pretty huge. When you’re saying don’t lecture, do you mean that the learners themselves or the business unit when you’re bringing them in to be part of the training, like—

Doris Tempelmeyer: All of them.

Colin Forward: All of it.

Doris Tempelmeyer: All of the above. All of the stakeholders. So you turn that conversation from a monologue into a dialogue, one-way street into a two-way street. That’s what I mean.

Colin Forward: Okay. So this may be a little bit digging for one of our last questions, but I mean, have you made any mistakes in that process going to a more remote model and realizing you weren’t engaging? Or maybe you’re kind of accidentally lecturing? Like, any stumbles along the way?

Doris Tempelmeyer: Every day. Every day, I make a lot of mistakes. I won’t say no; I’m not a perfect person. But from my mistakes, I thank goodness to that one, because I learned from it. That is one thing that I can adjust then. That everyone in the training—

Colin Forward: Any easy ones to make that you would tell other training professionals to watch out for in that sense? As far as making sure that you’re engaging people.

Doris Tempelmeyer: One pet peeve of mine: reading what’s on the PowerPoint.

Colin Forward: Yeah, that’s one of Adam’s pet peeves too. He’s been beating that drum for a little while.

Doris Tempelmeyer: You don’t read what’s on the PowerPoint. Otherwise, you just lost your audience. Engagement is not there.

Colin Forward: Yeah, for sure. It’s a rule of thumb that probably everyone knows, but we all see people make that mistake, right?

Doris Tempelmeyer: Yea, use active learning approach.

Colin Forward: Yeah, well, that’s I think a good practical ending note. So, I really want to thank you for your time today, Doris. This has been a great conversation, and I hope it’s helpful to some other learning and development professionals out there that are facing some of these challenges. So thank you very much for your insight.

I wish you the best of luck in getting through the changes that the industry is going through right now. And it sounds like you’re well on your way. So, thanks again.

Doris Tempelmeyer: Thanks for having me. Thank you.

Adam Wagner: Yeah, thanks, everyone. This was Training the Modern Workforce Live, presented by Allogy. Remember to join us every other week for more discussions on all things training and continued learning.

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